> This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> ignore as much as possible
> but--Maybe this will help many and some--
Observer
No one and nothing created gays they are simply part of the natural
process. There exists no scientifically verifiable substantiating data
proving the existence or any act of any god (creator). No creator no
creation its just that simple that complex and that wonderful..
Read this
Main article: Homosexuality in animals
Two male Mallards, Anas platyrhynchos. Mallards form male-female pairs
only until the female lays eggs, at which time the male leaves the
female. Mallards have rates of male-male sexual activity that are
unusually high for birds, in some cases, as high as 19% of all pairs
in a population.[36]
The presence of same-sex sexual behaviour was not scientifically
observed on a large scale until recent times. Homosexual behaviour
does occur in the animal kingdom outside humans, especially in social
species, particularly in marine birds and mammals, monkeys, and the
great apes. Homosexual behaviour has been observed among 1,500
species, and in 500 of those it is well documented.[37]
To turn the approach on its head: No species has been found in
which homosexual behaviour has not been shown to exist, with the
exception of species that never have sex at all, such as sea urchins
and aphis. Moreover, a part of the animal kingdom is hermaphroditic,
truly bisexual. For them, homosexuality is not an issue.
—[1]
Georgetown University professor Janet Mann has specifically theorised
that homosexual behaviour, at least in dolphins, is an evolutionary
advantage that minimizes intraspecies aggression, especially among
males.
* Male penguin couples have been documented to mate for life,
build nests together, and to use a stone as a surrogate egg in nesting
and brooding. In 2004, the Central Park Zoo in the United States
replaced one male couple's stone with a fertilized egg, which the
couple then raised as their own offspring.[38] German and Japanese
zoos have also reported homosexual behaviour among their penguins.
This phenomenon has also been reported at Kelly Tarlton's Aquarium in
Auckland, New Zealand. "Humans have created the myth that sexuality
can be justified only by reproduction, which by definition limits it
to hetero sex," says Michael Bronski, author of The Pleasure
Principle: Culture, Backlash, and the Struggle for Gay Freedom. "But
here is an animal society that uses homosexuality to improve its
social life."
* Mounting of one female by another is common among cattle. (See
also, Freemartin. Freemartins occur because of clearly causal hormonal
factors at work during gestation.)
* Bonobos in zoos. After studying the primates for his book
Bonobo: The Forgotten Ape, primatologist Frans de Waal, a professor of
psychology at Emory University in Atlanta, says that such expressions
of intimacy are consistent with the homosexual behaviour of what he
terms "the erotic champions of the world." "Same-sex, opposite-sex —
bonobos just love sex play," de Waal said in an interview. "They have
so much sex, it gets boring."
* Homosexual behaviour in male sheep (found in 6-10% of rams) is
associated with variations in cerebral mass distribution and chemical
activity. A study reported in Endocrinology concluded that biological
and physiological factors are in effect.[39] These findings are
similar to human findings reported by Simon LeVay.
Approximately eight percent of [male] rams exhibit sexual
preferences [that is, even when given a choice] for male partners
(male-oriented rams) in contrast to most rams, which prefer female
partners (female-oriented rams). We identified a cell group within the
medial preoptic area/anterior hypothalamus of age-matched adult sheep
that was significantly larger in adult rams than in ewes...
* Male bighorn sheep are divisible into two kinds: the typical
males among whom homosexual behaviour, including intercourse, is
common and "effeminate sheep", or "behavioural transvestites", which
are not known to engage in homosexual behaviour.[4
> This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> ignore as much as possible
> but--Maybe this will help many and some--
I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
It is surely totally normal.
its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
> On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > ignore as much as possible
> > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
> If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
> population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
> it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
> just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
> hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
> plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
> ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
> sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
> consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
> with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
> have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
> It is surely totally normal.
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 7:19 AM, showmethehoney
<alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
> its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
> world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
> global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
> destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
Slippery slope fallacy.
Not everyone is gay, nor is everyone likely to be gay.
Learn to argue without resorting to logical fallacies and we might consider
taking you seriously.
> On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
> > On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > ignore as much as possible
> > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
> > If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
> > population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
> > it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
> > just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
> > hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
> > plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
> > ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
> > sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
> > consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
> > with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
> > have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
> > It is surely totally normal.
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> To post to this group, send email to
> atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
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> .
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> This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> ignore as much as possible
> but--Maybe this will help many and some--
klytu: Why is this a "very hard subject" for you? For some thought-
provoking background, you might want to give these books a read:
"Between XX and XY: Intersexuality and the Myth of Two Sexes", Gerald
N. Callahan, 2009
"Myths of Gender: Biological Theories About Women and Men", Anne
Fausto-Sterling, 1987
Both books discuss research that indicates the traditional line that
separates the genders is blurred and that human beings actually have a
continuum of genders with *very few* people being clearly male or
clearly female. Dr. Callahan's book is more of a primer for
background; Sterling's book gets more into theory. Studies like these
provide solid evidence that so-called gays and lesbians are not
suffering from some kind of psychological disorder nor are they
abnormal.
> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 7:19 AM, showmethehoney
> <alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
> > its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
> > world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
> > global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
> > destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
> Slippery slope fallacy.
> Not everyone is gay, nor is everyone likely to be gay.
> Learn to argue without resorting to logical fallacies and we might consider
> taking you seriously.
> > On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
> > > On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > > ignore as much as possible
> > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > > I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
> > > If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
> > > population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
> > > it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
> > > just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
> > > hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
> > > plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
> > > ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
> > > sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
> > > consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
> > > with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
> > > have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
> > > It is surely totally normal.
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> > .
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 10:55 AM, showmethehoney
<alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
> what is a fallacy about stating that gay people do not reproduce? i
> didnt say i thought anyone was going to become gay, let alone
> everyone...
You said.
---------------------------------
its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
----------------------------------
Note the statement "...if everybody became gay...there wouldn't be any more
people..."
> On Nov 7, 7:54 am, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 7:19 AM, showmethehoney
> > <alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
> > > its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
> > > world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
> > > global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
> > > destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
> > Slippery slope fallacy.
> > Not everyone is gay, nor is everyone likely to be gay.
> > Learn to argue without resorting to logical fallacies and we might
> consider
> > taking you seriously.
> > > On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
> > > > On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try
> to
> > > > > ignore as much as possible
> > > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > > > I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
> > > > If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
> > > > population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
> > > > it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
> > > > just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
> > > > hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
> > > > plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
> > > > ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
> > > > sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
> > > > consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
> > > > with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
> > > > have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
> > > > It is surely totally normal.
> > > --
> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups
> > > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> > > To post to this group, send email to
> > > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> <atheism-vs-christianity%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com<y%252Bunsubscribe@ googlegroups.com>
> > --
> > High Priestess of Ribbonology
> > God Is A Ribbon!
> > All Hail The Great Ribbon In The Skyhttp://
> science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2009/15oct_ibex.htm?list1303103- Hide quoted
> text -
> > - Show quoted text -
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
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I will anwer this as honest as I can without offending anybody except the
fact that I believe in the Bible---and what it says that it is an
abomination--that we should not do this----but I was thinking about
this---how did this begin to bring understanding for both sides---and of
able to put things in prospective---I do not make a final Judgement --our
Judge---it's not my call---but I was wondering how did this came about when
God started off with Man and Women---I wonder what was the first true
Gay./...I will disagree it is a natural process....why do I believe this it
started out with Man and Women---I do believe that in some humans (not all)
they are either born with more male or female hormones...
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:56 AM, klytu <jazzyjef...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Nov 6, 8:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > ignore as much as possible
> > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> klytu: Why is this a "very hard subject" for you? For some thought-
> provoking background, you might want to give these books a read:
> "Between XX and XY: Intersexuality and the Myth of Two Sexes", Gerald
> N. Callahan, 2009
> "Myths of Gender: Biological Theories About Women and Men", Anne
> Fausto-Sterling, 1987
> Both books discuss research that indicates the traditional line that
> separates the genders is blurred and that human beings actually have a
> continuum of genders with *very few* people being clearly male or
> clearly female. Dr. Callahan's book is more of a primer for
> background; Sterling's book gets more into theory. Studies like these
> provide solid evidence that so-called gays and lesbians are not
> suffering from some kind of psychological disorder nor are they
> abnormal.
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> To post to this group, send email to
> atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> .
> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.
Trance,,,,This is not starting trouble --why should we not have a
disscussion on things that might put all in prespective---Is this anti- or
not ...Is it excepted in the chruches ? Is it considered (a long process of
sickness)....I did not say kill...straight people have rights too.
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 8:39 AM, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com>wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 10:55 AM, showmethehoney <
> alenasha...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> what is a fallacy about stating that gay people do not reproduce? i
>> didnt say i thought anyone was going to become gay, let alone
>> everyone...
> You said.
> ---------------------------------
> its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
> world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
> global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
> destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
> ----------------------------------
> Note the statement "...if everybody became gay...there wouldn't be any more
> people..."
> That is the slippery slope fallacy.
> Learn some logic.
>> On Nov 7, 7:54 am, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 7:19 AM, showmethehoney
>> > <alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
>> > > its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
>> > > world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
>> > > global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
>> > > destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
>> > Slippery slope fallacy.
>> > Not everyone is gay, nor is everyone likely to be gay.
>> > Learn to argue without resorting to logical fallacies and we might
>> consider
>> > taking you seriously.
>> > > On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
>> > > > On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try
>> to
>> > > > > ignore as much as possible
>> > > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
>> > > > I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
>> > > > If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
>> > > > population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
>> > > > it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
>> > > > just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
>> > > > hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
>> > > > plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
>> > > > ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
>> > > > sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
>> > > > consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
>> > > > with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
>> > > > have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
>> > > > It is surely totally normal.
>> > > --
>> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> Groups
>> > > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
>> > > To post to this group, send email to
>> > > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
>> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>> > > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
>> <atheism-vs-christianity%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com<y%252Bunsubscribe@ googlegroups.com>
>> > --
>> > High Priestess of Ribbonology
>> > God Is A Ribbon!
>> > All Hail The Great Ribbon In The Skyhttp://
>> science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2009/15oct_ibex.htm?list1303103- Hide quoted
>> text -
>> > - Show quoted text -
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to
>> atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
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>> .
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> --
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On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:56 AM, klytu <jazzyjef...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Nov 6, 8:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > ignore as much as possible
> > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> klytu: Why is this a "very hard subject" for you? For some thought-
> provoking background, you might want to give these books a read:
> "Between XX and XY: Intersexuality and the Myth of Two Sexes", Gerald
> N. Callahan, 2009
> "Myths of Gender: Biological Theories About Women and Men", Anne
> Fausto-Sterling, 1987
> Both books discuss research that indicates the traditional line that
> separates the genders is blurred and that human beings actually have a
> continuum of genders with *very few* people being clearly male or
> clearly female. Dr. Callahan's book is more of a primer for
> background; Sterling's book gets more into theory. Studies like these
> provide solid evidence that so-called gays and lesbians are not
> suffering from some kind of psychological disorder nor are they
> abnormal.
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> To post to this group, send email to
> atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> .
> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 1:41 PM, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Trance,,,,This is not starting trouble --why should we not have a
> disscussion on things that might put all in prespective---Is this anti- or
> not ...Is it excepted in the chruches ? Is it considered (a long process of
> sickness)....I did not say kill...straight people have rights too.
That's why I'm explaining what a logical fallacy is to him, Doris, so that
we can have a discussion instead of just snide remarks.
I think that would be much more productive, don't you?
> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 8:39 AM, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com>wrote:
>> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 10:55 AM, showmethehoney <
>> alenasha...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>> what is a fallacy about stating that gay people do not reproduce? i
>>> didnt say i thought anyone was going to become gay, let alone
>>> everyone...
>> You said.
>> ---------------------------------
>> its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
>> world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
>> global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
>> destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
>> ----------------------------------
>> Note the statement "...if everybody became gay...there wouldn't be any
>> more people..."
>> That is the slippery slope fallacy.
>> Learn some logic.
>>> On Nov 7, 7:54 am, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 7:19 AM, showmethehoney
>>> > <alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
>>> > > its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
>>> > > world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
>>> > > global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
>>> > > destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
>>> > Slippery slope fallacy.
>>> > Not everyone is gay, nor is everyone likely to be gay.
>>> > Learn to argue without resorting to logical fallacies and we might
>>> consider
>>> > taking you seriously.
>>> > > On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
>>> > > > On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually
>>> try to
>>> > > > > ignore as much as possible
>>> > > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
>>> > > > I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
>>> > > > If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
>>> > > > population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
>>> > > > it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
>>> > > > just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
>>> > > > hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
>>> > > > plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
>>> > > > ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
>>> > > > sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
>>> > > > consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
>>> > > > with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
>>> > > > have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
>>> > > > It is surely totally normal.
>>> > > --
>>> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups
>>> > > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
>>> > > To post to this group, send email to
>>> > > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
>>> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>> > > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
>>> <atheism-vs-christianity%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com<y%252Bunsubscribe@ googlegroups.com>
>>> > --
>>> > High Priestess of Ribbonology
>>> > God Is A Ribbon!
>>> > All Hail The Great Ribbon In The Skyhttp://
>>> science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2009/15oct_ibex.htm?list1303103- Hide quoted
>>> text -
>>> > - Show quoted text -
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>>> "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to
>>> atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>> atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
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Yes I do..instead of being offended---I think this thread would shine light
on this--since this is Christianity-vs-atheism group...I think is a matter
of discerment and understanding...I really don't think anybody is going to
die from these threads...
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 10:47 AM, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com>wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 1:41 PM, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Trance,,,,This is not starting trouble --why should we not have a
>> disscussion on things that might put all in prespective---Is this anti- or
>> not ...Is it excepted in the chruches ? Is it considered (a long process of
>> sickness)....I did not say kill...straight people have rights too.
> That's why I'm explaining what a logical fallacy is to him, Doris, so that
> we can have a discussion instead of just snide remarks.
> I think that would be much more productive, don't you?
>> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 8:39 AM, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 10:55 AM, showmethehoney <
>>> alenasha...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>>> what is a fallacy about stating that gay people do not reproduce? i
>>>> didnt say i thought anyone was going to become gay, let alone
>>>> everyone...
>>> You said.
>>> ---------------------------------
>>> its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
>>> world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
>>> global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
>>> destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
>>> ----------------------------------
>>> Note the statement "...if everybody became gay...there wouldn't be any
>>> more people..."
>>> That is the slippery slope fallacy.
>>> Learn some logic.
>>>> On Nov 7, 7:54 am, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 7:19 AM, showmethehoney
>>>> > <alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
>>>> > > its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
>>>> > > world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
>>>> > > global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
>>>> > > destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
>>>> > Slippery slope fallacy.
>>>> > Not everyone is gay, nor is everyone likely to be gay.
>>>> > Learn to argue without resorting to logical fallacies and we might
>>>> consider
>>>> > taking you seriously.
>>>> > > On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
>>>> > > > On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually
>>>> try to
>>>> > > > > ignore as much as possible
>>>> > > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
>>>> > > > I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
>>>> > > > If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
>>>> > > > population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
>>>> > > > it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
>>>> > > > just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
>>>> > > > hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
>>>> > > > plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
>>>> > > > ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
>>>> > > > sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
>>>> > > > consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
>>>> > > > with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
>>>> > > > have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
>>>> > > > It is surely totally normal.
>>>> > > --
>>>> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>> Groups
>>>> > > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
>>>> > > To post to this group, send email to
>>>> > > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
>>>> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>>> > > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
>>>> <atheism-vs-christianity%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com<y%252Bunsubscribe@ googlegroups.com>
>>>> > --
>>>> > High Priestess of Ribbonology
>>>> > God Is A Ribbon!
>>>> > All Hail The Great Ribbon In The Skyhttp://
>>>> science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2009/15oct_ibex.htm?list1303103- Hide
>>>> quoted text -
>>>> > - Show quoted text -
>>>> --
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On Nov 7, 10:37 am, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I will anwer this as honest as I can without offending anybody except the
> fact that I believe in the Bible---and what it says that it is an
> abomination--that we should not do this----
The same book, Leviticus, also says that eating shellfish is an
abomination.
> but I was thinking about
> this---how did this begin to bring understanding for both sides---and of
> able to put things in prospective---I do not make a final Judgement --our
> Judge---it's not my call---but I was wondering how did this came about when
> God started off with Man and Women---I wonder what was the first true
> Gay./...I will disagree it is a natural process....
Of course it's natural process - that's why there are so many animals
who exhibit homosexual behvior.
> why do I believe this it started out with Man and Women---I do believe that in some humans (not all)
> they are either born with more male or female hormones...
In other words, you are admitting it's a natural process, while
denying that it's a natural process. You seem confused.
> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:56 AM, klytu <jazzyjef...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > On Nov 6, 8:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > ignore as much as possible
> > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > klytu: Why is this a "very hard subject" for you? For some thought-
> > provoking background, you might want to give these books a read:
> > "Between XX and XY: Intersexuality and the Myth of Two Sexes", Gerald
> > N. Callahan, 2009
> > "Myths of Gender: Biological Theories About Women and Men", Anne
> > Fausto-Sterling, 1987
> > Both books discuss research that indicates the traditional line that
> > separates the genders is blurred and that human beings actually have a
> > continuum of genders with *very few* people being clearly male or
> > clearly female. Dr. Callahan's book is more of a primer for
> > background; Sterling's book gets more into theory. Studies like these
> > provide solid evidence that so-called gays and lesbians are not
> > suffering from some kind of psychological disorder nor are they
> > abnormal.
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> > .
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.- Hide quoted text -
Ok----now that I'm relax now what ? I would really like to except your
natural process it would be easier...I'm sure I am trying to find some kind
of Justification's for this subject...I'm not Gay...but I know gays ...Have
work around them and have family (one) that is---this is why is important
for me to have some understanding...without being so Judgeing...The Gays
have told me I just don't understand...and I tell them I do understand they
don't understand....so when it comes to my beliefs vs their's---it does
cause conflict---I thought shedding some light on this of the origin that it
has stem from...would help everybody concern ...It is a matter of choice ?
On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 9:11 PM, Observer <mayors...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Nov 6, 5:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > ignore as much as possible
> > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> Observer
> No one and nothing created gays they are simply part of the natural
> process. There exists no scientifically verifiable substantiating data
> proving the existence or any act of any god (creator). No creator no
> creation its just that simple that complex and that wonderful..
> Read this
> Main article: Homosexuality in animals
> Two male Mallards, Anas platyrhynchos. Mallards form male-female pairs
> only until the female lays eggs, at which time the male leaves the
> female. Mallards have rates of male-male sexual activity that are
> unusually high for birds, in some cases, as high as 19% of all pairs
> in a population.[36]
> The presence of same-sex sexual behaviour was not scientifically
> observed on a large scale until recent times. Homosexual behaviour
> does occur in the animal kingdom outside humans, especially in social
> species, particularly in marine birds and mammals, monkeys, and the
> great apes. Homosexual behaviour has been observed among 1,500
> species, and in 500 of those it is well documented.[37]
> To turn the approach on its head: No species has been found in
> which homosexual behaviour has not been shown to exist, with the
> exception of species that never have sex at all, such as sea urchins
> and aphis. Moreover, a part of the animal kingdom is hermaphroditic,
> truly bisexual. For them, homosexuality is not an issue.
> —[1]
> Georgetown University professor Janet Mann has specifically theorised
> that homosexual behaviour, at least in dolphins, is an evolutionary
> advantage that minimizes intraspecies aggression, especially among
> males.
> * Male penguin couples have been documented to mate for life,
> build nests together, and to use a stone as a surrogate egg in nesting
> and brooding. In 2004, the Central Park Zoo in the United States
> replaced one male couple's stone with a fertilized egg, which the
> couple then raised as their own offspring.[38] German and Japanese
> zoos have also reported homosexual behaviour among their penguins.
> This phenomenon has also been reported at Kelly Tarlton's Aquarium in
> Auckland, New Zealand. "Humans have created the myth that sexuality
> can be justified only by reproduction, which by definition limits it
> to hetero sex," says Michael Bronski, author of The Pleasure
> Principle: Culture, Backlash, and the Struggle for Gay Freedom. "But
> here is an animal society that uses homosexuality to improve its
> social life."
> * Mounting of one female by another is common among cattle. (See
> also, Freemartin. Freemartins occur because of clearly causal hormonal
> factors at work during gestation.)
> * Bonobos in zoos. After studying the primates for his book
> Bonobo: The Forgotten Ape, primatologist Frans de Waal, a professor of
> psychology at Emory University in Atlanta, says that such expressions
> of intimacy are consistent with the homosexual behaviour of what he
> terms "the erotic champions of the world." "Same-sex, opposite-sex —
> bonobos just love sex play," de Waal said in an interview. "They have
> so much sex, it gets boring."
> * Homosexual behaviour in male sheep (found in 6-10% of rams) is
> associated with variations in cerebral mass distribution and chemical
> activity. A study reported in Endocrinology concluded that biological
> and physiological factors are in effect.[39] These findings are
> similar to human findings reported by Simon LeVay.
> Approximately eight percent of [male] rams exhibit sexual
> preferences [that is, even when given a choice] for male partners
> (male-oriented rams) in contrast to most rams, which prefer female
> partners (female-oriented rams). We identified a cell group within the
> medial preoptic area/anterior hypothalamus of age-matched adult sheep
> that was significantly larger in adult rams than in ewes...
> * Male bighorn sheep are divisible into two kinds: the typical
> males among whom homosexual behaviour, including intercourse, is
> common and "effeminate sheep", or "behavioural transvestites", which
> are not known to engage in homosexual behaviour.[4
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
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On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 11:05 AM, Bob T. <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote:
> On Nov 7, 10:37 am, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I will anwer this as honest as I can without offending anybody except the
> > fact that I believe in the Bible---and what it says that it is an
> > abomination--that we should not do this----
> The same book, Leviticus, also says that eating shellfish is an
> abomination.
> > but I was thinking about
> > this---how did this begin to bring understanding for both sides---and of
> > able to put things in prospective---I do not make a final Judgement --our
> > Judge---it's not my call---but I was wondering how did this came about
> when
> > God started off with Man and Women---I wonder what was the first true
> > Gay./...I will disagree it is a natural process....
> Of course it's natural process - that's why there are so many animals
> who exhibit homosexual behvior.
> > why do I believe this it started out with Man and Women---I do believe
> that in some humans (not all)
> > they are either born with more male or female hormones...
> In other words, you are admitting it's a natural process, while
> denying that it's a natural process. You seem confused.
> - Bob T.
> > On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:56 AM, klytu <jazzyjef...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Nov 6, 8:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > > ignore as much as possible
> > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > > klytu: Why is this a "very hard subject" for you? For some thought-
> > > provoking background, you might want to give these books a read:
> > > "Between XX and XY: Intersexuality and the Myth of Two Sexes", Gerald
> > > N. Callahan, 2009
> > > "Myths of Gender: Biological Theories About Women and Men", Anne
> > > Fausto-Sterling, 1987
> > > Both books discuss research that indicates the traditional line that
> > > separates the genders is blurred and that human beings actually have a
> > > continuum of genders with *very few* people being clearly male or
> > > clearly female. Dr. Callahan's book is more of a primer for
> > > background; Sterling's book gets more into theory. Studies like these
> > > provide solid evidence that so-called gays and lesbians are not
> > > suffering from some kind of psychological disorder nor are they
> > > abnormal.
> > > --
> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups
> > > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> > > To post to this group, send email to
> > > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
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On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 1:59 PM, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Yes I do..instead of being offended---I think this thread would shine light
> on this--since this is Christianity-vs-atheism group...I think is a matter
> of discerment and understanding...I really don't think anybody is going to
> die from these threads...
> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 10:47 AM, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com>wrote:
>> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 1:41 PM, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Trance,,,,This is not starting trouble --why should we not have a
>>> disscussion on things that might put all in prespective---Is this anti- or
>>> not ...Is it excepted in the chruches ? Is it considered (a long process of
>>> sickness)....I did not say kill...straight people have rights too.
>> That's why I'm explaining what a logical fallacy is to him, Doris, so that
>> we can have a discussion instead of just snide remarks.
>> I think that would be much more productive, don't you?
>>> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 8:39 AM, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 10:55 AM, showmethehoney <
>>>> alenasha...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>>>> what is a fallacy about stating that gay people do not reproduce? i
>>>>> didnt say i thought anyone was going to become gay, let alone
>>>>> everyone...
>>>> You said.
>>>> ---------------------------------
>>>> its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
>>>> world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
>>>> global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
>>>> destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
>>>> ----------------------------------
>>>> Note the statement "...if everybody became gay...there wouldn't be any
>>>> more people..."
>>>> That is the slippery slope fallacy.
>>>> Learn some logic.
>>>>> On Nov 7, 7:54 am, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> > On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 7:19 AM, showmethehoney
>>>>> > <alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
>>>>> > > its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
>>>>> > > world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened
>>>>> by
>>>>> > > global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
>>>>> > > destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
>>>>> > Slippery slope fallacy.
>>>>> > Not everyone is gay, nor is everyone likely to be gay.
>>>>> > Learn to argue without resorting to logical fallacies and we might
>>>>> consider
>>>>> > taking you seriously.
>>>>> > > On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
>>>>> > > > On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> > > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually
>>>>> try to
>>>>> > > > > ignore as much as possible
>>>>> > > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
>>>>> > > > I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
>>>>> > > > If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
>>>>> > > > population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
>>>>> > > > it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
>>>>> > > > just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
>>>>> > > > hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
>>>>> > > > plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
>>>>> > > > ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
>>>>> > > > sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
>>>>> > > > consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
>>>>> > > > with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
>>>>> > > > have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
>>>>> > > > It is surely totally normal.
>>>>> > > --
>>>>> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>>> Groups
>>>>> > > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
>>>>> > > To post to this group, send email to
>>>>> > > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
>>>>> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>>>> > > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
>>>>> <atheism-vs-christianity%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com<y%252Bunsubscribe@ googlegroups.com>
>>>>> > --
>>>>> > High Priestess of Ribbonology
>>>>> > God Is A Ribbon!
>>>>> > All Hail The Great Ribbon In The Skyhttp://
>>>>> science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2009/15oct_ibex.htm?list1303103- Hide
>>>>> quoted text -
>>>>> > - Show quoted text -
>>>>> --
>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 2:08 PM, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok----now that I'm relax now what ? I would really like to except your
> natural process it would be easier...I'm sure I am trying to find some kind
> of Justification's for this subject...I'm not Gay...but I know gays ...Have
> work around them and have family (one) that is---this is why is important
> for me to have some understanding...without being so Judgeing...The Gays
> have told me I just don't understand...and I tell them I do understand they
> don't understand....so when it comes to my beliefs vs their's---it does
> cause conflict---I thought shedding some light on this of the origin that it
> has stem from...would help everybody concern ...It is a matter of choice ?
No, it's not a matter of choice. That's the point Doris.
Science is showing us that people who are Gay are born that way.
It is normal for a certain percentage of our population to be gay. It's
probably always been like and probably always will be.
And the same thing occurs amongst other species of animals.
> On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 9:11 PM, Observer <mayors...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Nov 6, 5:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
>> > ignore as much as possible
>> > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
>> Observer
>> No one and nothing created gays they are simply part of the natural
>> process. There exists no scientifically verifiable substantiating data
>> proving the existence or any act of any god (creator). No creator no
>> creation its just that simple that complex and that wonderful..
>> Read this
>> Main article: Homosexuality in animals
>> Two male Mallards, Anas platyrhynchos. Mallards form male-female pairs
>> only until the female lays eggs, at which time the male leaves the
>> female. Mallards have rates of male-male sexual activity that are
>> unusually high for birds, in some cases, as high as 19% of all pairs
>> in a population.[36]
>> The presence of same-sex sexual behaviour was not scientifically
>> observed on a large scale until recent times. Homosexual behaviour
>> does occur in the animal kingdom outside humans, especially in social
>> species, particularly in marine birds and mammals, monkeys, and the
>> great apes. Homosexual behaviour has been observed among 1,500
>> species, and in 500 of those it is well documented.[37]
>> To turn the approach on its head: No species has been found in
>> which homosexual behaviour has not been shown to exist, with the
>> exception of species that never have sex at all, such as sea urchins
>> and aphis. Moreover, a part of the animal kingdom is hermaphroditic,
>> truly bisexual. For them, homosexuality is not an issue.
>> —[1]
>> Georgetown University professor Janet Mann has specifically theorised
>> that homosexual behaviour, at least in dolphins, is an evolutionary
>> advantage that minimizes intraspecies aggression, especially among
>> males.
>> * Male penguin couples have been documented to mate for life,
>> build nests together, and to use a stone as a surrogate egg in nesting
>> and brooding. In 2004, the Central Park Zoo in the United States
>> replaced one male couple's stone with a fertilized egg, which the
>> couple then raised as their own offspring.[38] German and Japanese
>> zoos have also reported homosexual behaviour among their penguins.
>> This phenomenon has also been reported at Kelly Tarlton's Aquarium in
>> Auckland, New Zealand. "Humans have created the myth that sexuality
>> can be justified only by reproduction, which by definition limits it
>> to hetero sex," says Michael Bronski, author of The Pleasure
>> Principle: Culture, Backlash, and the Struggle for Gay Freedom. "But
>> here is an animal society that uses homosexuality to improve its
>> social life."
>> * Mounting of one female by another is common among cattle. (See
>> also, Freemartin. Freemartins occur because of clearly causal hormonal
>> factors at work during gestation.)
>> * Bonobos in zoos. After studying the primates for his book
>> Bonobo: The Forgotten Ape, primatologist Frans de Waal, a professor of
>> psychology at Emory University in Atlanta, says that such expressions
>> of intimacy are consistent with the homosexual behaviour of what he
>> terms "the erotic champions of the world." "Same-sex, opposite-sex —
>> bonobos just love sex play," de Waal said in an interview. "They have
>> so much sex, it gets boring."
>> * Homosexual behaviour in male sheep (found in 6-10% of rams) is
>> associated with variations in cerebral mass distribution and chemical
>> activity. A study reported in Endocrinology concluded that biological
>> and physiological factors are in effect.[39] These findings are
>> similar to human findings reported by Simon LeVay.
>> Approximately eight percent of [male] rams exhibit sexual
>> preferences [that is, even when given a choice] for male partners
>> (male-oriented rams) in contrast to most rams, which prefer female
>> partners (female-oriented rams). We identified a cell group within the
>> medial preoptic area/anterior hypothalamus of age-matched adult sheep
>> that was significantly larger in adult rams than in ewes...
>> * Male bighorn sheep are divisible into two kinds: the typical
>> males among whom homosexual behaviour, including intercourse, is
>> common and "effeminate sheep", or "behavioural transvestites", which
>> are not known to engage in homosexual behaviour.[4
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to
>> atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>> atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
>> .
>> For more options, visit this group at
>> http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> To post to this group, send email to
> atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
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> .
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> http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.
On Nov 7, 11:08 am, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok----now that I'm relax now what ? I would really like to except your
> natural process it would be easier...I'm sure I am trying to find some kind
> of Justification's for this subject...I'm not Gay...but I know gays ...Have
> work around them and have family (one) that is---this is why is important
> for me to have some understanding...without being so Judgeing...The Gays
> have told me I just don't understand...and I tell them I do understand they
> don't understand....
Well, that's where you go wrong. You don't need to understand - you
just need to accept that some people are different from you.
> so when it comes to my beliefs vs their's---it does cause conflict---
It only causes conflict because you think that people ought to care
what the Bible says about homosexuality.
> I thought shedding some light on this of the origin that it
> has stem from...would help everybody concern ...It is a matter of choice ?
I assume from your name that you are a woman, and from your arguments
that you are heterosexual. How would you feel if the government told
you that you were not allowed to marry a man, that you had to marry a
woman instead? How would you feel if preachers and politicians
denounced your love of men as "unnatural" and "Satanic"?
> On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 9:11 PM, Observer <mayors...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Nov 6, 5:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > ignore as much as possible
> > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > Observer
> > No one and nothing created gays they are simply part of the natural
> > process. There exists no scientifically verifiable substantiating data
> > proving the existence or any act of any god (creator). No creator no
> > creation its just that simple that complex and that wonderful..
> > Read this
> > Main article: Homosexuality in animals
> > Two male Mallards, Anas platyrhynchos. Mallards form male-female pairs
> > only until the female lays eggs, at which time the male leaves the
> > female. Mallards have rates of male-male sexual activity that are
> > unusually high for birds, in some cases, as high as 19% of all pairs
> > in a population.[36]
> > The presence of same-sex sexual behaviour was not scientifically
> > observed on a large scale until recent times. Homosexual behaviour
> > does occur in the animal kingdom outside humans, especially in social
> > species, particularly in marine birds and mammals, monkeys, and the
> > great apes. Homosexual behaviour has been observed among 1,500
> > species, and in 500 of those it is well documented.[37]
> > To turn the approach on its head: No species has been found in
> > which homosexual behaviour has not been shown to exist, with the
> > exception of species that never have sex at all, such as sea urchins
> > and aphis. Moreover, a part of the animal kingdom is hermaphroditic,
> > truly bisexual. For them, homosexuality is not an issue.
> > —[1]
> > Georgetown University professor Janet Mann has specifically theorised
> > that homosexual behaviour, at least in dolphins, is an evolutionary
> > advantage that minimizes intraspecies aggression, especially among
> > males.
> > * Male penguin couples have been documented to mate for life,
> > build nests together, and to use a stone as a surrogate egg in nesting
> > and brooding. In 2004, the Central Park Zoo in the United States
> > replaced one male couple's stone with a fertilized egg, which the
> > couple then raised as their own offspring.[38] German and Japanese
> > zoos have also reported homosexual behaviour among their penguins.
> > This phenomenon has also been reported at Kelly Tarlton's Aquarium in
> > Auckland, New Zealand. "Humans have created the myth that sexuality
> > can be justified only by reproduction, which by definition limits it
> > to hetero sex," says Michael Bronski, author of The Pleasure
> > Principle: Culture, Backlash, and the Struggle for Gay Freedom. "But
> > here is an animal society that uses homosexuality to improve its
> > social life."
> > * Mounting of one female by another is common among cattle. (See
> > also, Freemartin. Freemartins occur because of clearly causal hormonal
> > factors at work during gestation.)
> > * Bonobos in zoos. After studying the primates for his book
> > Bonobo: The Forgotten Ape, primatologist Frans de Waal, a professor of
> > psychology at Emory University in Atlanta, says that such expressions
> > of intimacy are consistent with the homosexual behaviour of what he
> > terms "the erotic champions of the world." "Same-sex, opposite-sex —
> > bonobos just love sex play," de Waal said in an interview. "They have
> > so much sex, it gets boring."
> > * Homosexual behaviour in male sheep (found in 6-10% of rams) is
> > associated with variations in cerebral mass distribution and chemical
> > activity. A study reported in Endocrinology concluded that biological
> > and physiological factors are in effect.[39] These findings are
> > similar to human findings reported by Simon LeVay.
> > Approximately eight percent of [male] rams exhibit sexual
> > preferences [that is, even when given a choice] for male partners
> > (male-oriented rams) in contrast to most rams, which prefer female
> > partners (female-oriented rams). We identified a cell group within the
> > medial preoptic area/anterior hypothalamus of age-matched adult sheep
> > that was significantly larger in adult rams than in ewes...
> > * Male bighorn sheep are divisible into two kinds: the typical
> > males among whom homosexual behaviour, including intercourse, is
> > common and "effeminate sheep", or "behavioural transvestites", which
> > are not known to engage in homosexual behaviour.[4
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> > .
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.- Hide quoted text -
On Nov 7, 10:19 pm, showmethehoney <alenasha...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
> world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
> global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
> destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
On the continuum of sexuality, it is normal. This is not a choice
that
gays have. There's is one of attraction, and who am I to say it's not
normal. I don't walk in their shoes.
I don't understand your analogy to global warming, sorry.
> On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
> > On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > ignore as much as possible
> > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
> > If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
> > population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
> > it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
> > just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
> > hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
> > plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
> > ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
> > sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
> > consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
> > with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
> > have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
> > It is surely totally normal.
On Nov 8, 4:37 am, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I will anwer this as honest as I can without offending anybody except the
> fact that I believe in the Bible---and what it says that it is an
> abomination--that we should not do this----but I was thinking about
> this---how did this begin to bring understanding for both sides---and of
> able to put things in prospective---I do not make a final Judgement --our
> Judge---it's not my call---but I was wondering how did this came about when
> God started off with Man and Women---I wonder what was the first true
> Gay./...I will disagree it is a natural process....why do I believe this it
> started out with Man and Women---I do believe that in some humans (not all)
> they are either born with more male or female hormones...
Yup and that's the best reason for not relying on some bits of wriitng
over
two thousand years old, and rather use the "evolved brain" (or in
some
people, try to at least develop it) you have. After all you are a
product of
evolution, whether you or we like it or not.
> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:56 AM, klytu <jazzyjef...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > On Nov 6, 8:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > ignore as much as possible
> > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > klytu: Why is this a "very hard subject" for you? For some thought-
> > provoking background, you might want to give these books a read:
> > "Between XX and XY: Intersexuality and the Myth of Two Sexes", Gerald
> > N. Callahan, 2009
> > "Myths of Gender: Biological Theories About Women and Men", Anne
> > Fausto-Sterling, 1987
> > Both books discuss research that indicates the traditional line that
> > separates the genders is blurred and that human beings actually have a
> > continuum of genders with *very few* people being clearly male or
> > clearly female. Dr. Callahan's book is more of a primer for
> > background; Sterling's book gets more into theory. Studies like these
> > provide solid evidence that so-called gays and lesbians are not
> > suffering from some kind of psychological disorder nor are they
> > abnormal.
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> > .
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.
On Nov 7, 1:37 pm, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I will anwer this as honest as I can without offending anybody except the
> fact that I believe in the Bible---and what it says that it is an
> abomination--that we should not do this
klytu: I think that the bible is just wrong about this. I understand
that you believe the bible is God's inspired word, but I do not. I
think this is an example of something in the bible that was made up by
people who didn't understand enough about the matter and who wrote
what they believed to be true.
>----but I was thinking about
> this---how did this begin to bring understanding for both sides---and of
> able to put things in prospective---I do not make a final Judgement --our
> Judge---it's not my call---but I was wondering how did this came about when
> God started off with Man and Women---I wonder what was the first true
> Gay./...I will disagree it is a natural process....why do I believe this it
> started out with Man and Women---I do believe that in some humans (not all)
> they are either born with more male or female hormones...
klytu: In another post you asked what the books I recommended had to
say. I'll summarize what I remember, but it's better to read them
yourself if you have the interest and the time.
The books show evidence that people don't fall into two specific
genders of male and female. Traditionally, at birth physicians use
certain indicators to decide whether a person is male or female,
parents accept this classification for their children, and the child
is raised accordingly. However the evidence is that there are not two
specific genders within the human population, there is a continuum of
genders.
There are many people that have been raised as females, but are really
more towards the male part of the spectrum and vice-versa. Those whose
obvious physical traits are right near the middle of the spectrum, so-
called "hermaphrodites", get the most attention. (The recent situation
involving the olympic runner Caster Semenya comes to mind:
http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/32785120/ns/sports-olympic_sports)
Gerald Callahan recommends that parents use the birth physician's
gender classification only provisionally. He suggests that they
observe their young children closely for a couple of years to see what
gender they naturally gravitate towards before deciding on raising
them as either male or female.
In summary, the evidence presented in the books indicates that there
are all sorts of important, not physically obvious genetic factors
that come into play to determine our gender and our overall sexuality.
The evidence is that homosexuals are not suffering from a mental
disorder, they are not abominations, and they are not "choosing" their
sexual preference any more than heterosexuals do. To use an imperfect
analogy, human genders and sexual preferences are shades of gray, not
black and white.
> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:56 AM, klytu <jazzyjef...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > On Nov 6, 8:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > ignore as much as possible
> > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > klytu: Why is this a "very hard subject" for you? For some thought-
> > provoking background, you might want to give these books a read:
> > "Between XX and XY: Intersexuality and the Myth of Two Sexes", Gerald
> > N. Callahan, 2009
> > "Myths of Gender: Biological Theories About Women and Men", Anne
> > Fausto-Sterling, 1987
> > Both books discuss research that indicates the traditional line that
> > separates the genders is blurred and that human beings actually have a
> > continuum of genders with *very few* people being clearly male or
> > clearly female. Dr. Callahan's book is more of a primer for
> > background; Sterling's book gets more into theory. Studies like these
> > provide solid evidence that so-called gays and lesbians are not
> > suffering from some kind of psychological disorder nor are they
> > abnormal.
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> > .
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.
I would feel like my rights would be taken away ...what is in the world is
in the world...you could shed me a little light on what you think about what
the Bible thinks about it...
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 11:26 AM, Bob T. <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote:
> On Nov 7, 11:08 am, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Ok----now that I'm relax now what ? I would really like to except your
> > natural process it would be easier...I'm sure I am trying to find some
> kind
> > of Justification's for this subject...I'm not Gay...but I know gays
> ...Have
> > work around them and have family (one) that is---this is why is important
> > for me to have some understanding...without being so Judgeing...The Gays
> > have told me I just don't understand...and I tell them I do understand
> they
> > don't understand....
> Well, that's where you go wrong. You don't need to understand - you
> just need to accept that some people are different from you.
> > so when it comes to my beliefs vs their's---it does cause conflict---
> It only causes conflict because you think that people ought to care
> what the Bible says about homosexuality.
> > I thought shedding some light on this of the origin that it
> > has stem from...would help everybody concern ...It is a matter of choice
> ?
> I assume from your name that you are a woman, and from your arguments
> that you are heterosexual. How would you feel if the government told
> you that you were not allowed to marry a man, that you had to marry a
> woman instead? How would you feel if preachers and politicians
> denounced your love of men as "unnatural" and "Satanic"?
> - Bob T.
> > On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 9:11 PM, Observer <mayors...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Nov 6, 5:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > > ignore as much as possible
> > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > > Observer
> > > No one and nothing created gays they are simply part of the natural
> > > process. There exists no scientifically verifiable substantiating data
> > > proving the existence or any act of any god (creator). No creator no
> > > creation its just that simple that complex and that wonderful..
> > > Read this
> > > Main article: Homosexuality in animals
> > > Two male Mallards, Anas platyrhynchos. Mallards form male-female pairs
> > > only until the female lays eggs, at which time the male leaves the
> > > female. Mallards have rates of male-male sexual activity that are
> > > unusually high for birds, in some cases, as high as 19% of all pairs
> > > in a population.[36]
> > > The presence of same-sex sexual behaviour was not scientifically
> > > observed on a large scale until recent times. Homosexual behaviour
> > > does occur in the animal kingdom outside humans, especially in social
> > > species, particularly in marine birds and mammals, monkeys, and the
> > > great apes. Homosexual behaviour has been observed among 1,500
> > > species, and in 500 of those it is well documented.[37]
> > > To turn the approach on its head: No species has been found in
> > > which homosexual behaviour has not been shown to exist, with the
> > > exception of species that never have sex at all, such as sea urchins
> > > and aphis. Moreover, a part of the animal kingdom is hermaphroditic,
> > > truly bisexual. For them, homosexuality is not an issue.
> > > —[1]
> > > Georgetown University professor Janet Mann has specifically theorised
> > > that homosexual behaviour, at least in dolphins, is an evolutionary
> > > advantage that minimizes intraspecies aggression, especially among
> > > males.
> > > * Male penguin couples have been documented to mate for life,
> > > build nests together, and to use a stone as a surrogate egg in nesting
> > > and brooding. In 2004, the Central Park Zoo in the United States
> > > replaced one male couple's stone with a fertilized egg, which the
> > > couple then raised as their own offspring.[38] German and Japanese
> > > zoos have also reported homosexual behaviour among their penguins.
> > > This phenomenon has also been reported at Kelly Tarlton's Aquarium in
> > > Auckland, New Zealand. "Humans have created the myth that sexuality
> > > can be justified only by reproduction, which by definition limits it
> > > to hetero sex," says Michael Bronski, author of The Pleasure
> > > Principle: Culture, Backlash, and the Struggle for Gay Freedom. "But
> > > here is an animal society that uses homosexuality to improve its
> > > social life."
> > > * Mounting of one female by another is common among cattle. (See
> > > also, Freemartin. Freemartins occur because of clearly causal hormonal
> > > factors at work during gestation.)
> > > * Bonobos in zoos. After studying the primates for his book
> > > Bonobo: The Forgotten Ape, primatologist Frans de Waal, a professor of
> > > psychology at Emory University in Atlanta, says that such expressions
> > > of intimacy are consistent with the homosexual behaviour of what he
> > > terms "the erotic champions of the world." "Same-sex, opposite-sex —
> > > bonobos just love sex play," de Waal said in an interview. "They have
> > > so much sex, it gets boring."
> > > * Homosexual behaviour in male sheep (found in 6-10% of rams) is
> > > associated with variations in cerebral mass distribution and chemical
> > > activity. A study reported in Endocrinology concluded that biological
> > > and physiological factors are in effect.[39] These findings are
> > > similar to human findings reported by Simon LeVay.
> > > Approximately eight percent of [male] rams exhibit sexual
> > > preferences [that is, even when given a choice] for male partners
> > > (male-oriented rams) in contrast to most rams, which prefer female
> > > partners (female-oriented rams). We identified a cell group within the
> > > medial preoptic area/anterior hypothalamus of age-matched adult sheep
> > > that was significantly larger in adult rams than in ewes...
> > > * Male bighorn sheep are divisible into two kinds: the typical
> > > males among whom homosexual behaviour, including intercourse, is
> > > common and "effeminate sheep", or "behavioural transvestites", which
> > > are not known to engage in homosexual behaviour.[4
> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups
> > > "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> > > To post to this group, send email to
> > > atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > > atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> <atheism-vs-christianity%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com<y%252Bunsubscribe@ googlegroups.com>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Atheism vs Christianity" group.
> To post to this group, send email to
> atheism-vs-christianity@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> atheism-vs-christianity+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<atheism-vs-christianit y%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> .
> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/atheism-vs-christianity?hl=en.
> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 11:26 AM, Bob T. <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote:
> > On Nov 7, 11:08 am, Doris Ragland <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Ok----now that I'm relax now what ? I would really like to except your
> > > natural process it would be easier...I'm sure I am trying to find some
> > kind
> > > of Justification's for this subject...I'm not Gay...but I know gays
> > ...Have
> > > work around them and have family (one) that is---this is why is important
> > > for me to have some understanding...without being so Judgeing...The Gays
> > > have told me I just don't understand...and I tell them I do understand
> > they
> > > don't understand....
> > Well, that's where you go wrong. You don't need to understand - you
> > just need to accept that some people are different from you.
> > > so when it comes to my beliefs vs their's---it does cause conflict---
> > It only causes conflict because you think that people ought to care
> > what the Bible says about homosexuality.
> > > I thought shedding some light on this of the origin that it
> > > has stem from...would help everybody concern ...It is a matter of choice
> > ?
> > I assume from your name that you are a woman, and from your arguments
> > that you are heterosexual. How would you feel if the government told
> > you that you were not allowed to marry a man, that you had to marry a
> > woman instead? How would you feel if preachers and politicians
> > denounced your love of men as "unnatural" and "Satanic"?
> > - Bob T.
> > > On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 9:11 PM, Observer <mayors...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > On Nov 6, 5:34 pm, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try to
> > > > > ignore as much as possible
> > > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > > > Observer
> > > > No one and nothing created gays they are simply part of the natural
> > > > process. There exists no scientifically verifiable substantiating data
> > > > proving the existence or any act of any god (creator). No creator no
> > > > creation its just that simple that complex and that wonderful..
> > > > Read this
> > > > Main article: Homosexuality in animals
> > > > Two male Mallards, Anas platyrhynchos. Mallards form male-female pairs
> > > > only until the female lays eggs, at which time the male leaves the
> > > > female. Mallards have rates of male-male sexual activity that are
> > > > unusually high for birds, in some cases, as high as 19% of all pairs
> > > > in a population.[36]
> > > > The presence of same-sex sexual behaviour was not scientifically
> > > > observed on a large scale until recent times. Homosexual behaviour
> > > > does occur in the animal kingdom outside humans, especially in social
> > > > species, particularly in marine birds and mammals, monkeys, and the
> > > > great apes. Homosexual behaviour has been observed among 1,500
> > > > species, and in 500 of those it is well documented.[37]
> > > > To turn the approach on its head: No species has been found in
> > > > which homosexual behaviour has not been shown to exist, with the
> > > > exception of species that never have sex at all, such as sea urchins
> > > > and aphis. Moreover, a part of the animal kingdom is hermaphroditic,
> > > > truly bisexual. For them, homosexuality is not an issue.
> > > > —[1]
> > > > Georgetown University professor Janet Mann has specifically theorised
> > > > that homosexual behaviour, at least in dolphins, is an evolutionary
> > > > advantage that minimizes intraspecies aggression, especially among
> > > > males.
> > > > * Male penguin couples have been documented to mate for life,
> > > > build nests together, and to use a stone as a surrogate egg in nesting
> > > > and brooding. In 2004, the Central Park Zoo in the United States
> > > > replaced one male couple's stone with a fertilized egg, which the
> > > > couple then raised as their own offspring.[38] German and Japanese
> > > > zoos have also reported homosexual behaviour among their penguins.
> > > > This phenomenon has also been reported at Kelly Tarlton's Aquarium in
> > > > Auckland, New Zealand. "Humans have created the myth that sexuality
> > > > can be justified only by reproduction, which by definition limits it
> > > > to hetero sex," says Michael Bronski, author of The Pleasure
> > > > Principle: Culture, Backlash, and the Struggle for Gay Freedom. "But
> > > > here is an animal society that uses homosexuality to improve its
> > > > social life."
> > > > * Mounting of one female by another is common among cattle. (See
> > > > also, Freemartin. Freemartins occur because of clearly causal hormonal
> > > > factors at work during gestation.)
> > > > * Bonobos in zoos. After studying the primates for his book
> > > > Bonobo: The Forgotten Ape, primatologist Frans de Waal, a professor of
> > > > psychology at Emory University in Atlanta, says that such expressions
> > > > of intimacy are consistent with the homosexual behaviour of what he
> > > > terms "the erotic champions of the world." "Same-sex, opposite-sex —
> > > > bonobos just love sex play," de Waal said in an interview. "They have
> > > > so much sex, it gets boring."
> > > > * Homosexual behaviour in male sheep (found in 6-10% of rams) is
> > > > associated with variations in cerebral mass distribution and chemical
> > > > activity. A study reported in Endocrinology concluded that biological
> > > > and physiological factors are in effect.[39] These findings are
> > > > similar to human findings reported by Simon LeVay.
> > > > Approximately eight percent of [male] rams exhibit sexual
> > > > preferences [that is, even when given a choice] for male partners
> > > > (male-oriented rams) in contrast to most rams, which prefer female
> > > > partners (female-oriented rams). We identified a cell group within the
> > > > medial preoptic area/anterior hypothalamus of age-matched adult sheep
> > > > that was significantly larger in adult rams than in ewes...
> > > > * Male bighorn sheep are divisible into two kinds: the typical
> > > > males among whom homosexual behaviour, including intercourse, is
> > > > common and "effeminate sheep", or "behavioural transvestites", which
> > > > are not known to engage in homosexual behaviour.[4
> > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 10:55 AM, showmethehoney
> <alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
> > what is a fallacy about stating that gay people do not reproduce? i
> > didnt say i thought anyone was going to become gay, let alone
> > everyone...
> You said.
> ---------------------------------
> its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
> world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
> global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
> destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
> ----------------------------------
> Note the statement "...if everybody became gay...there wouldn't be any more
> people..."
> That is the slippery slope fallacy.
> Learn some logic.
> > On Nov 7, 7:54 am, Trance Gemini <trancegemi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 7:19 AM, showmethehoney
> > > <alenasha...@googlemail.com>wrote:
> > > > its totally normal? hmmmm .... i guess if everybody became gay the
> > > > world would be a happier place. at least it wouldnt be threatened by
> > > > global warming, cuz before long there wouldnt be any more people to
> > > > destroy it. talk about a generation gap! ;-)
> > > Slippery slope fallacy.
> > > Not everyone is gay, nor is everyone likely to be gay.
> > > Learn to argue without resorting to logical fallacies and we might
> > consider
> > > taking you seriously.
> > > > On Nov 7, 3:56 am, philosophy <smwil...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
> > > > > On Nov 7, 11:34 am, DJ <dr4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > This subject has been a very hard subject for me and I usually try
> > to
> > > > > > ignore as much as possible
> > > > > > but--Maybe this will help many and some--
> > > > > I think gays have been no more "created" than heterosexuals.
> > > > > If you think about the Bell Curve, and see the majority of the
> > > > > population as being heterosexuals, (or maybe even bisexual -
> > > > > it's your pick), then gays fit on the continuum. Sexuality is
> > > > > just an expression of the individual. Some are gay, some are
> > > > > hetero, some are bi, some are lesbian and some are just
> > > > > plain weird. All I'm saying, is there are a vast number of
> > > > > ways of expressing ones sexuality. Except when that
> > > > > sexuality is forced onto another person or child (ie without
> > > > > consent) it is acceptable. Any person consenting to be
> > > > > with another, to do what they want, is okay with me. I don't
> > > > > have to watch, be in the bedroom or even think about it.
> > > > > It is surely totally normal.
> > > > --
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> > > --
> > > High Priestess of Ribbonology
> > > God Is A Ribbon!
> > > All Hail The Great Ribbon In The Skyhttp://
> > science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2009/15oct_ibex.htm?list1303103- Hide quoted
> > text -
> > > - Show quoted text -
> > --
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